August 19, 2007 at 11:20 pm #4653sharkyParticipant
August 16, 2007
To whom it may concern:
Judgeâ€™s Stands at the Lorne and â€œRoadâ€August 20, 2007 at 2:09 pm #29706Peter KarwackiParticipant
Thanks Joe. Your comments on this board are greatly appreciated, and needed.
Thanks for raising the issue of the need to cleanup: whether its our garbage or somebody else’s. May I suggest a big river cleanup day with organized volunteers followed by a big party at Wilderness Tours?
PeteAugust 20, 2007 at 4:29 pm #29707zack splaineParticipant
im in for that!August 21, 2007 at 5:40 am #29708GrahameHParticipant
Since WT has an "adoption" sign up on Grant’s Settlement Rd., this is a valid topic.
To pin the trash on the roadway on kayakers alone is wrong. How many rafters from outside of the area does your company bring in each day? How much do they each have invested in protecting the local ecosystem and preserving it’s beauty? How many fast food meals do they purchase on the way to your resort with packaging just waiting to be thrown out a window so it doesn’t smell up their car?
(my truck smells like river, wet dog, and citronella)
But seriously, some people are getting sloppy at the put in. Owl/MKC’s generosity should be appreciated and their property respected. Likewise with the Lorne/Pushbutton lot and WT/Farmer Black’s takeout.
The river seems fairly free from trash except for the cigarette butts at some of the play spots.
I remember the posting earlier in the summer about a whole kayak being "littered" into a grant settlement ditch… I guess that was an extreme case that placed the blame squarely on us.
This weekend, I "littered" a paddle blade in RS Phil’s Hole. If it’s found, it has my contact info on it. Feel free to report me to the Ottawa River Keeper.
Sometimes when I paddle flatwater, I wonder how many pairs of sunglasses, broken gear, and even boats without airbags are under the surface.August 21, 2007 at 1:21 pm #29709Kevin MParticipant
Since you were responsible for the shack.
Can you answer a couple of questions?
Do you think the shack looks good and improves the look of the river?
You may one day like to look back at some of your old pictures of the river and ask whether your contributions to the river have improved or detracted from the natural beauty of the river.
Also it would be nice to know what you think of your guides behaviour in the post I copied from earlier this summer. It is regarding your guides and some kayakers.
me and a couple other had an incedent with wilderness tour while sitting in the eddy waiting to surf babyface,, the wilderness tours guides just kept goin one after another and wouldnt let us kayakers take a surf,, one guy in the front of the line spoke up and told the guide next in line to let us take some surfs to,,
well the guide didnt like that and freaked right out on this guy,, after he was done freak out on this kayaker the guide said "go on cheif and take you surf",, this guy pulled out of the eddy and paddled onto the wave and as soon as he got on the wave this guide had the idea to pull out of the eddy and knock him off the wave ( ran right over him).
the guide got back in the eddy and went right to the front of the line again with out letting any of us go again,, we spoke up again trying to get us out there to and then this guide lost it again, " we are geting paid to be on this river so get off our river and go back to work because we are on holidays",, another kayaker said " we are also on holidays that is why we are out here" , this raft guide wasnt done talking $h1t to us,," we are geting paid to be here and these people are paying to be out here so we will run over you kayakers anytime", and then he had the nerve to tell us paddlers that he was going to tape his river knife to the end of his paddle blade so when he went past us he could jab us with it!!! none of us kayaker liked that at all and about 5 of us including myself just lost it with this guy and we couldnt take it anymore,, i ended up leaving because he told us that they were going to stay twice as long just to piss us off,,
me and 3 of my friends got off the river and went down to pushbuton where 3 of the paddlers who were also at babyface where now,, these guys recognised me and said thank god the rafts dont stop here lol,,, and from then on we had an awsome time with out the rafts!!
anyways try to have a good paddle with all the rafts out there and if a guide tryes to sho off or anything just go to a different playspot or dont listen to them
River Clean ups are always a good idea. Our local club cleans up the Grand River every spring. It really pisses me off to clean up other peoples garbage but I figure I can handle is once a year. As for the put ins and take outs, I think all kayakers should make an effort to improve the look of the places we get to use for free. While we are waiting for the shuttle it would not be much work to pick up the garbage that we see.
I know your boats are in a hurry but you may want to get your guides to collect the broken and discarded wilderness paddles that they find on the way down the river. It would not take much for all of us to leave the river better than we found it.August 21, 2007 at 3:34 pm #29710Gary GeorgeParticipant
Over here at the Gull we (Whitewater Ontario) have been sending our summer student / employee down both banks of the Gull to clean the banks on a weekly basis.
On a personal note, since moving into a rural setting similar to the area of Grants Settlement Rd I have come to the conclusion that visitors and locals have about the same attitude regarding littering the roads. The difference being that the locals who litter tend to do it every day all year round. Visitors are generally only around breifly.
There is a corner in Minden on the main street where some redneck throws his pop bottle out the window daily. Always the same spot, always weekdays. Somebody cleans it up and the jerk does it all over again. There are several spots around the region where this kind of littering is seen. Same refuse, same location, mainly weekdays. Visitors would litter much more randomly.
I’m willing to bet my favourite boat that most of the litter on Grants Settlement Rd comes from folks who live in the area.
Another example here would be the public bank of the Gull which is littered with worm boxes. Much of the fishing on the Gull is done by regulars who are around all the time. Paddler type litter (water bottles, bagged lunch stuff and minicell foam) actually shows up more on the Preserve side rather than the other. In terms of what the kids find when cleaning the banks, the public side is much worse and has a much greater variety of items that paddlers likely wouldn’t be bringing to the river. You know, beer bottles and cans, pop cans, fast food wrappers, fishing related things.
Considering the footprint that rafting companies have in this area it seems the least they can do to take on a stewardship role, as some have. It is expected of us at Whitewater Ontario, even demanded by some yet we have little resource or financial abilty to do so.
As for paddlers that litter and abuse, who don’t give at least as much as they take, well it seems we’ll never be rid of them but it sure would be nice if we were.August 21, 2007 at 4:11 pm #29711"GrahameH":2gmdin9x wrote:Sometimes when I paddle flatwater, I wonder how many pairs of sunglasses, broken gear, and even boats without airbags are under the surface.[/quote:2gmdin9x]
I lost count at how many single flip flops, etc I have found floating in the river. I just gather them up and put them on big rock.
How about all those rafting paddles you see floating. I just throw them in the boat and drop them off at the take out or give them out as birthday gifts.August 21, 2007 at 5:33 pm #29712GrantParticipant"cmnypny":eh5qot73 wrote:How about all those rafting paddles you see floating. I just throw them in the boat and drop them off at the take out or give them out as birthday gifts.[/quote:eh5qot73]
Or take them to ER and bend’umAugust 21, 2007 at 6:01 pm #29713"Grant":1dfbatj2 wrote:Or take them to ER and bend’um[/quote:1dfbatj2]
Actually that was not a rafting paddle but my own … I had it straightened out and it is now my spare as there is now a flat spot in the shaft.August 22, 2007 at 3:32 am #29714surfboyParticipant
have access to carry the trash. And while we’re at it let’s allow [b:1enz1qq3]private [/b:1enz1qq3]rafters, Shredders etc. with the skills and the equipment access all season.
I really appreciate the access provided by the rafting companies for kayakers, but hope that they could agree to differentiate between skilled private paddlers in a small raft or shredder and a pirate raft trip.
After passing multiple cottages and a 400 meter wide dam I can live with the judging shack at the lorne.
In my experience, paddlers as a group don’t do a great job in keeping our impact low, but we are also much better than the average (?), or rafting customer or guide.
In Friendsville, half a dozen fishermen or local kids would generally leave more trash around the takeout than a hundred or more boaters on a release day, although the glass and aluminum recycling bins would be full.
Joe and the dentist are not the only ones who pick up trash on grants Settlement rd. but only company has a sign taking credit.
all that being said let’s all try to be good woodsmen and leave the rivers we paddle a little better than we found them.
John MasonAugust 22, 2007 at 5:21 pm #29715RodeoClownParticipant
Apparently someone didn’t like Mr. K’s response to this and took matters into their own hands. This morning when I headed out to push button, I noticed most of the structure was missing- the floor was still there, but the rest of it, or rather the charred remains of the rest of it, were lying smoldering in a pile at river level. Keep in mind that the structure was build from pressure treated lumber- so the chromium, copper, and arsenic which weren’t released into the air as a result of burning it will sit on shore until it rains and/or the river comes up and will be washed into the river. So nice work keeping the Ottawa river wild, scenic, clean, and healthy there guys. I didn’t investigate any more, but it looked like the doors, windows, and roof were missing- don’t know if they were carried off or what.
I can see both sides of the story here, and don’t really have a horse in this race- the shelter wasn’t all that attractive, but I can see the utility of leaving it as well. It doesn’t seem that there was much financial reason for or against removing it for Joe K. However you feel about it, I really don’t think that this was an appropriate way to deal with the situation.
JeremyAugust 22, 2007 at 5:35 pm #29716"RodeoClown":s5o71d90 wrote:This morning when I headed out to push button, I noticed most of the structure was missing- the floor was still there, but the rest of it, or rather the charred remains of the rest of it, were lying smoldering in a pile at river level.[/quote:s5o71d90]
I can’t believe someone actually did that … I would have rather seen it taken down properly and the wood re-used to build something else like a shed in my back yard.August 22, 2007 at 6:17 pm #29717cboaterParticipant
Looks like the recent poll gave some stupid punks an idea, considering that the "burn it down" option was the most popular.
Good job there, yahoos. You’re now local legends! Congratulations on being influenced by a boater board over your own sense of judgment in your decision to burn a shack down! Next stop: MENSA!August 22, 2007 at 6:42 pm #29718GrantParticipant
We’ve had alot of storms lately, so IF it was lightning that burned it down, than disregard.
Why would anyone burn down a structure on the river, especially if there were already palns to remove the sturcture in a non-harmful manner?
Have we devolved so far, so fast?August 22, 2007 at 6:45 pm #29719"Grant":2su2r16g wrote:Have we devolved so far, so fast?[/quote:2su2r16g]
Had to look that one up:
v. deÂ·volved, deÂ·volvÂ·ing, deÂ·volves
1. To pass on or delegate to another: The senator devolved the duties of office upon a group of aides.
2. Archaic To cause to roll onward or downward.
1. To be passed on or transferred to another: The burden of proof devolved upon the defendant. The estate devolved to an unlikely heir.
2. To degenerate or deteriorate gradually: After several hours the discussion had devolved into a shouting match.
3. Archaic To roll onward or downward.
[Middle English devolven, to transfer, from Old French devolver, to confer, ascribe, from Latin dvolvere, to roll down, fall to : d-, de- + volvere, to roll; see wel-2 in Indo-European roots.]
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